Article in the Herald Leader today!

[icehouse1]

There is an article pertaining to the a house bill that would restore voting rights to ex-felons. Does this seem right to you all? Not to me.. They committed a crime and should lose that right. Hell, I believe that if you don't have a job, you shouldn't be allowed to vote. You shouldn't be allowed to help decide how tax money is being spent, if you are not doing your part in paying taxes! What is your thoughts on all of this.

[ChopperDoc]

Here is my take on it:

If you screw up and go to jail, even for a violent crime, ALL of your rights should be restored if you are found to be 'rehabilitated' and fit to release back out into society. If you are unfit to be sent back out to into society you should not be released or you should be put down - depending on the crime. If you screw up again you go back for good, or are put down - depending on the crime.

Our system is a revolving door for criminals. It is failing, thus the reason they continue to be punished outside of incarceration. There is no place to keep them so they are just released back out amongst us with 'reduced' rights in the hopes that they will not commit that crime again.

Not the way it should work.

[Rem700]

Agreed with CD

[WLJ]

How do you feel about the move to remove the right of employers to ask about past convictions?
I myself have mixed feelings about it for many of the same reasons that CD gave in his post.

[Mike]

Jail is just a college for teaching crime.

[WLJ]

Jail is just a college for teaching crime.

Earn your 4 year degree

[BIGC]

I don't have a "job" but I guess I shouldn't have the right to vote even though I take no handouts?

[icehouse1]

I don't have a "job" but I guess I shouldn't have the right to vote even though I take no handouts?

Well, I guess I should have stated that in a different manner, If you can work, but are too damn lazy to work and take handouts from the gubment, then no, IMO you shouldn't be allowed to help decide how my tax dollars are spent. If you pay taxes, then that is a different story. Retired, disabled, etc.... you all know what I mean.

[Frailer]

I, too, am of the opinion that convicted felons should have all their rights restored once they have completed their jail time and probation.

While we're on the subject, we need to re-think the whole concept of "felon." Not all "felonies" are created equal--and they vary *wildly* from state-to-state.

[Frailer]

As to the rest, I don't think a one should have to "earn" their basic rights.

We start making that argument and we put ourselves on a very slippery slope.

[jackalo626]

As to the rest, I don't think a one should have to "earn" their basic rights.

We start making that argument and we put ourselves on a very slippery slope.

I agree with this. And on topic of voting, not all votes are just fiscal votes. Plenty of votes about crime, human rights, policy, importation/exportation, etc etc etc.

[icehouse1]

Soooooooooo... drug dealers, baby mammas with multiple kids by multiple men for welfare money, convicted murderers, rapists and I could go on, should have all of the same rights that law abiding, hard working people have? And before anyone says it, a stay at home mother is a job, a self employed person, IMHO is working.. If you provide for your family, you are doing your part.. I can't stand those that expect handouts and live as well as I do off of my efforts!

I guess we are going to disagree on this one.. but that is ok... everyone has their right to an opinion..

[Jason]

If you're making all these exceptions for stay at home moms, disabled, retired, etc. then who gets to decide who is "good enough" to vote albeit unemployed and who is an undesirable that doesn't have the right to vote?

Personally I'm not a big fan of the government getting to call a shot like that.

[icehouse1]

There is NO ONE on this forum that does not know someone personally that is taking advantage of the system! Period! End of discussion!

If you are ok with it, so be it.. That is your right...

[icehouse1]

If you're making all these exceptions for stay at home moms, disabled, retired, etc. then who gets to decide who is "good enough" to vote albeit unemployed and who is an undesirable that doesn't have the right to vote?

Personally I'm not a big fan of the government getting to call a shot like that.

If you are selling drugs to kids! Child pornography! Rape convictions! Murder convictions! The government doesn't call that shot, the courts do!

As I have said before, it is your right to disagree with me.. But if you look at who voted for Obummer, they are the same ones that think handouts are good for our country!

[Frailer]

There is NO ONE on this forum that does not know someone personally that is taking advantage of the system! Period! End of discussion!

If you are ok with it, so be it.. That is your right...

There's a difference between "being OK" with thieves (which is what those who take advantage of the system are) and believing they should be deprived of their essential rights.

Just like an "innocent until proven guilty" justice system means a lot of dirtbags walk, a country founded on the concept of individual liberty means a lot of folks are going to do stuff that *really* pisses you off.

[Frailer]

...If you are selling drugs to kids! Child pornography! Rape convictions! Murder convictions! The government doesn't call that shot, the courts do!

Uh...the judicial system is part of the government.

It's in the Constitution.

[son of liberty]

Altering the voting system to only allow them who you deem as worthy ,may as well be eliminating the vote and liberty altogether. While I share your disdain for worthless leeches , its the government that is stealing our money from us, removing the vote of the worthless from an already degraded flawed system no longer based on the constitution would solve nothing..



Im With CD on the felons , debt paid or not

[baknblack]

It's a whole lot easier to get a felony conviction than most people realize.
30 years ago or so my x wife was on unemployment for about 4 months. About 3 days before she found another full time job she spent 2 days substitute teaching. By the time the state got around to paying her for those 2 days she had been working for 2 months. Being young and stupid we overlooked the 75 or so dollars.
Unemployment fraud they wanted to charge her with. Class D felony. We said hey, we made an honest mistake. Here's the 75 back. The state said only way your getting out of this is pay back all the unemployment. Lawyer said take the deal or you run the real risk of a felony conviction.
We paid back all the money. So, in my opinion some felony convictions have to be total bull shit.
Just saying.

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[jackalo626]

Altering the voting system to only allow them who you deem as worthy ,may as well be eliminating the vote and liberty altogether. While I share your disdain for worthless leeches , its the government that is stealing our money from us, removing the vote of the worthless from an already degraded flawed system no longer based on the constitution would solve nothing..



Im With CD on the felons , debt paid or not

I am of this opinion also.

[inthewaterky]

There is NO ONE on this forum that does not know someone personally that is taking advantage of the system! Period! End of discussion!

If you are ok with it, so be it.. That is your right...

Define taking advantage of the system. I would say that I don't know anyone on the system. But depends on what you think taking advantage of is?

[baknblack]

There is NO ONE on this forum that does not know someone personally that is taking advantage of the system! Period! End of discussion!

If you are ok with it, so be it.. That is your right...

I personally know enough to make up for anyone that doesn't. I call none of them friends. Three of them for drinking and drugs. Another claims to have a bad back. I've seen him out cutting and throwing firewood.
They're all of the Caucasian race. Not that it makes any difference.
It could be racist though.

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[kyswede]

My daughter's husband was convicted of a felony last year......bigamy.
Seems the judge didn't sign his divorce papers, though his lawyer said they were signed. So when he married my daughter several months later, he was guilty of a felony. Supposedly the felony will be removed from his record after 18 months of no more legal trouble. We shall see. BTW several members on here met him at New Haven on July 14, 2012.

[guncrank1]

I agree with CD

[ChopperDoc]

Soooooooooo... drug dealers, baby mammas with multiple kids by multiple men for welfare money, convicted murderers, rapists and I could go on, should have all of the same rights that law abiding, hard working people have? And before anyone says it, a stay at home mother is a job, a self employed person, IMHO is working.. If you provide for your family, you are doing your part.. I can't stand those that expect handouts and live as well as I do off of my efforts!

I guess we are going to disagree on this one.. but that is ok... everyone has their right to an opinion..

First off... ya gotta forget everything you know about how our system works now. My comments were about how it SHOULD work. If it worked like I laid out then the worst of society would be incarcerated for life or put down, thus they would not be having the same rights as the rest of us.

All of those crimes have circumstances. Even murder. Let's say that a 23 year old guy who is a CCDW holder comes upon a situation where he thinks someone is in danger. he uses his weapon to defend who he believes to be a victim, but he is wrong. The person he shot was an undercover FED. This 23 year old gets charged and convicted. He is now a murderer. He does 10 years and gets parole. What do you think is the likelihood that he will commit a crime again? Probably slim. Why should his right not be restored? Is his mistake somehow making him less deserving of the right to defend himself with a firearm? Is he any less justified to have the right to vote?

Our system is not working. It will only get worse. Eventually we will all be assumed guilty of something and there will be a demand to give up our rights because we MIGHT commit a crime.